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Post by bullmatt on Jan 2, 2010 22:39:53 GMT
Terra means earth anton as im sure you know and these dogs were of size and quality to go to ground, they were also brilliant at vermin control, something a dog 45lb i doubt would be. You know this im sure yeah but the point of the cross wasnt to get an earth dog it was to get a fighting/baiting dog, of diferant sizes to suit. |
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Post by hiphoplyricalrobot on Jan 2, 2010 22:42:07 GMT
I would call him a Bull and terrier yes, as we do need to respect there ancestory but i would in no way consider him to be of Terrier type. Type varies within a breed, and i dont feel the whole spectrum is represented in the UK much to our disadvantage. I would love to se a 26lb Bull Terrier.  |
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Post by frank on Jan 2, 2010 22:42:21 GMT
Btw here's what i think is a very intersting photo. Circa 1900   Caption is "british sporting man with dog". I think this is one of the more early types of bull & terrier crossings where the types were not as much defined. I think its a shame this type doesnt exist today. I am sure I have seen heads like that, so not really lost. Only think we lost in most is the length of back and legs. Because in my opinion, specially those smaller dogs, 99,9 % do not have enough of both of those things. |
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Post by frank on Jan 2, 2010 22:46:43 GMT
Terra means earth anton as im sure you know and these dogs were of size and quality to go to ground, they were also brilliant at vermin control, something a dog 45lb i doubt would be. You know this im sure yeah but the point of the cross wasnt to get an earth dog it was to get a fighting/baiting dog, of diferant sizes to suit. Have to agree that that is our generall thought yes, also mine. I have once in a discussion on Bullbreeds online written a whole fictious idea about the existense of the Fightingdogs. Do not come there anymore because of lack of time and the speed of the discussions day and night, but maybe somebody can look it up for me? And let me know what you all think ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D |
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Post by hiphoplyricalrobot on Jan 2, 2010 22:47:24 GMT
Terra means earth anton as im sure you know and these dogs were of size and quality to go to ground, they were also brilliant at vermin control, something a dog 45lb i doubt would be. You know this im sure Yes but from what your where saying my gist was it also meant a certain size limit. But then i look at some other modern terriers and they are 19" (wheatens for example) Yes that is my implication. Ive heard 12" high by 12" long is ideal. I do not know wheather this is completly right though |
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Post by bullmatt on Jan 2, 2010 22:48:01 GMT
I would call him a Bull and terrier yes, as we do need to respect there ancestory but i would in no way consider him to be of Terrier type. Type varies within a breed, and i dont feel the whole spectrum is represented in the UK much to our disadvantage. I would love to se a 26lb Bull Terrier. he hasnt got a bulldog build though has he? so what type would you call him? |
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Post by bullmatt on Jan 2, 2010 22:50:22 GMT
heres a 30lb one for starters.  |
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Post by dog on Jan 2, 2010 22:53:53 GMT
I think Sonny leans towards the the hound part of the Bull Terrier's make up. There were alot of breeds involved in the Bull Terrier. There isn't such a wide ancestry in the Stafford.
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Post by anton on Jan 2, 2010 22:56:07 GMT
heres a 30lb one for starters. i dont see it...? |
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Post by hiphoplyricalrobot on Jan 2, 2010 22:56:11 GMT
Terra means earth anton as im sure you know and these dogs were of size and quality to go to ground, they were also brilliant at vermin control, something a dog 45lb i doubt would be. You know this im sure yeah but the point of the cross wasnt to get an earth dog it was to get a fighting/baiting dog, of diferant sizes to suit. That is my definition of a terrier mate. The smaller pit dogs are small enough and agile enough to carry out some terrier jobs and have done so through out the years there fore enableing them to hang on to the title terrier. The cross was of course to produce pit dogs, all sizes were used, so all sizes should be represented within the country of its birth. Maybe my mistake was to put 2 debates in 1. .....1.The term terrier, is it correct, 2. Are larger dog breeding tendencies causing the demise of the smaller type reducing a true representation of all types, oh well sorry peps |
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Post by hiphoplyricalrobot on Jan 2, 2010 22:57:04 GMT
a 30lb pup mate
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Post by anton on Jan 2, 2010 22:58:20 GMT
haha well its an interstind discussion.
I could also argue that its the breeders of smaller dogs, crossing them with frencies & other dwarf breeds that have created a horrible conformation on the smaller sized staffies.
I would say the Changes to the breed standard are alos to blame.
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Post by hiphoplyricalrobot on Jan 2, 2010 23:00:01 GMT
Diffrent topic all together mate
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Post by anton on Jan 2, 2010 23:01:17 GMT
I guess, but if the people that have dwarf small staff these days replaced it with a well built one, wouldnt that solve the balance in the uk aswell?
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Post by bullmatt on Jan 2, 2010 23:03:04 GMT
heres a 30lb one for starters. i dont see it...? look at the white 30lb bullterrier under the writing |
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Post by anton on Jan 2, 2010 23:04:08 GMT
look at the white 30lb bullterrier under the writing ah I thought you wouldve posted a mini b&t |
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Post by bullmatt on Jan 2, 2010 23:07:01 GMT
a year old, we will see, but i dont think she will be over 35lb.i recon its coz your half a midget youve got little man and little dog syndrome. |
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Post by hiphoplyricalrobot on Jan 2, 2010 23:07:10 GMT
would you want pug blood in your dogs past ? off topic me thinks, i dont think it would solve the problem at all mate
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Post by hiphoplyricalrobot on Jan 2, 2010 23:08:22 GMT
Least i aint got snow on me head lofty
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Post by quinlent on Jan 2, 2010 23:10:33 GMT
taking a airdale terrier or an irish terrier as an example i don't think hight / size is an issue specifically. what differs a terrier from a retriever or a pointer or a husky mainly is its character.
The willingness to fight and not surrender is linked to the functioning of the metabolic functioning of a dog.
it is not the trimmed down dog that is the natural lets say fighting dog it is the cannot be fed fat dog that is the natural fighting dog.
the size of the dog is of no importance as size will bring a weight and the weight decides a match to happen and not the size. when speed is required the bigger dog is in huge disadvantage towards a smaller specimen of the same type when the space is limited. and that was mainly the case.
the understanding of the SBT starts with understanding what has happened to the bull terrier. we should learn our lessons as today there is a big agression problem among EBT. The developpement of the Bulldog is of no importance to the Stafford or the Bull terrier that is a freak show on it's own.
In my believes the Stafford was created out of the English White terrier and the Bulldog and to me it would have been not surprisingly that the bulldog was used for the same reason Colour was brought back to the EBT and the importance of Colour in Dogo Argentino's.
I think this mix has two classifications the rich and the poor people. the rich people as there status alows them creating more and more overdone quality's talking about it. and the poor man just wanted a dog that did the job for the family be it fighting in the pit working at a badger den or hunting vermin in general. a holiday in the east of Europe has given me the insight of the importance of a smaller dog they cost smaller money (lighter weight is also smaller) And the people that had these dogs (The original Bull Terrier - the first requested name for there breed) where not the rich people of the UK but the poor. And the White cavalier was settled among the rich. within the stafford be they blues or blacks reds or fawns you see that our economical changes had huge affect on our views towards dogs the EBT APBT AM STAFF and SBT are the same breed with different develloppements due to econimical circomstances.
i see the SBT as the workingmans dog of early 1900 which clearly makes it a poor mans dog. and i reckon that the size is irrelavant but the natural weight is of huge importance. And that the functinality has to be a proven part within the types we use. Poor people have no symphathy for fasion but for function
and as long as we strive for that we can discuss our preferations about type till we die but we will have to face and honour the best dog at the end of the day.
Cheers Marco
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Post by anton on Jan 2, 2010 23:10:42 GMT
would you want pug blood in your dogs past ? off topic me thinks, i dont think it would solve the problem at all mate no definantly not, thats exactly what i am saying. |
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Post by dog on Jan 2, 2010 23:11:11 GMT
Careful Matt, he'll punch you in the kneecaps!
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Post by bullmatt on Jan 2, 2010 23:11:32 GMT
fucking love you lot and this forum , GOODNIGHT  |
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Post by quinlent on Jan 2, 2010 23:11:49 GMT
Btw here's what i think is a very intersting photo. Circa 1900 Caption is "british sporting man with dog". I think this is one of the more early types of bull & terrier crossings where the types were not as much defined. I think its a shame this type doesnt exist today. I am sure I have seen heads like that, so not really lost. Only think we lost in most is the length of back and legs. Because in my opinion, specially those smaller dogs, 99,9 % do not have enough of both of those things. i still have that type mate thru Blossom |
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Post by quinlent on Jan 2, 2010 23:17:05 GMT
fucking love you lot and this forum , GOODNIGHT yer getting old mate! ;D Cheers anyway i am digesting a pizza before i go to bed YEEHAAA |
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Post by hiphoplyricalrobot on Jan 2, 2010 23:22:36 GMT
ive got cheese on toast!
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Post by quinlent on Jan 2, 2010 23:28:29 GMT
i enjoyed a spinache pizza delicious now i am trying cheese on toast well what to say i am working at the moment ;D Marco |
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Post by hiphoplyricalrobot on Jan 2, 2010 23:29:38 GMT
lol
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max
Full Member
Posts: 193
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Post by max on Jan 2, 2010 23:29:59 GMT
I had cheese on toast for brekkie this morning and very nice it was to..  spinach pizza whats that about Marco?? must be a dutch thing |
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Post by anton on Jan 2, 2010 23:34:09 GMT
great idee! tea, toast with cheese & maynoaise yum. If only i had some fresh herbs. |
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spinach pizza whats that about Marco?? must be a dutch thing