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Post by neilsherlock on Dec 19, 2010 23:23:25 GMT
Ive had bulls 20 years. Oh well Owen moderates on here not me.
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Post by poacher on Dec 19, 2010 23:31:14 GMT
I gathered the latter with his threat
shame though as I think you are far less antagonistic than he is ;-)
i must apologise about my thinking you hadnt kept your breed long I just assumed that as historians you would have both tried your bulls at drawing at least before the ban came in, my fault for assuming sorry, theres plenty of boys around owen with experience of this maybe you should think about adding one of them to your team it can only enhance the section surely?
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Post by dog on Dec 20, 2010 0:16:08 GMT
I've no intention of banning you. I'd like you to stay but I've never tolerated abuse as was in the post I deleted and that's what I was particularly refering to. You obviously felt it was OTT as you said you wanted to edit the swearing out anyway.
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Post by poacher on Dec 20, 2010 7:57:13 GMT
i did but you sent me a pm with the threat of a ban?
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moro
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Post by moro on Dec 20, 2010 13:42:25 GMT
We'll always try to look for that 100% dog/bitch, but as you know, in the real world it doens't work like that, it's not always possible if your are looking for a "real" working dog. No offence but, you don't place real athletes with weak pasterns and yet you place a "non athlete" undershot dog 1st, isn't that judging with a "double standard" if skeleton conformation is on top of your list? Hello Moro, your interpretation of non athletic not mine obvously. I dont remember an undershot dog?. Moro i cant be arsed with this anymore. I wish id picked Franks judgeing apart last summer now as believe me there were comments there too. Frank says this approach is a more direct approach than the English. To me it is just pure Rude. Get off the band wagon mate, its not attractive. Neil, like i said, i am not here to offend you, i was only asking you. You find this approach rude? and yet you commented on the dutch board about a "weak specimen" in your eyes called "Osiris" with flat feet and weak pasterns that Frank placed last summer in the UK wich by the way Frank told you about the misstake he made on the show, not the other way arround and yet you choose to use it in the discussion. Talking about a "double standard" again. Anyway i'll get off the wagon mate. It was nice seeing you again, cheers. Martijn
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Post by neilsherlock on Dec 20, 2010 15:42:02 GMT
Frank told me your right, please do not think it had not already been mentioned though, i did not post this all over the place though. i disagree with you , you disagree with me, so what. Im not sure where your double standard comments come from but ey, again i could not care less. Cheers Martijn, see you again im sure.
neil
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Post by Shakka-Staffs on Dec 20, 2010 16:35:57 GMT
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Post by neilsherlock on Dec 20, 2010 20:49:24 GMT
Not slagging them off m8, discussing them. ive never said anything i have not said to your face mate. I think you will find that Martijn has tried to get a rise out of you there. I really dont mind telling you as i have when ive judged him before.
I really couldn't give a fuck what Martijn and Frank think, but if ive upset you Shaka and Kirsty by a discusion i had with them i appologise.
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Post by teapot on Dec 20, 2010 21:05:31 GMT
Road work...put the miles in every day on road and that will sort that out.
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Post by frank on Dec 20, 2010 21:51:36 GMT
Weak pasterns usually come with poor shoulder alinement, poor shoulders usually come with a reduction in neck leverage. It all adds up. And did it? As you where hands on, you should have noticed it. I can find that back in the critics? My opinion is that you aproach these classes as a Kennelclub show, and not from the perspective of a working animal.
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Post by frank on Dec 20, 2010 21:54:53 GMT
Your dog is not slagged off by me m8, as I really like your dog(as my placement stated). That I missed one thing does not make your dog a lesser animal, in MY eyes. If you pm me your phonenumber I will call you this week.
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Post by Shakka-Staffs on Dec 20, 2010 21:57:59 GMT
No Neil im not upset you know me, and i you, your right youve never said anything you havnt said to my face as far as i know. I know my dogs have never placed higher than 3rd apart from when they were puppies, when they both won all thier comformations lol. (even if it was by mistake) and i also know they have a few faults each. "WEAK COMFORMATION SPECIMINS" To all concerned as to my dogs shape size colour or anything else. Comformation for me !!!! I dont enjoy standing in a ring and niether really do my 2 muts i think were all bored of it. My wife has dragged us to every local/not so local, show for the past 3 years i have boxes of trophys and rosettes but it just dont do it for me. When we bred, apart from trying to improve on abbey, we bred to get ourselves a running stafford. Having already got ourselves a good allround pulldog. I said i wanted a stafford to win races, not too tall but all leg. I think i got exactly what i wanted. I could not be happier with the way hes turned out faults and all. How many people can say they bred thier first litter and got what they asked for ? Of course if id got both id be even happier but it really dont bother me as while it may not be to everyones cup of tea, running is what i do with my dogs and that is exactly what we wanted from our pup. While it may not be the purpose he was originally for, its what i wanted him for. 100meters at 16months 8:53 secs (lazer timed) 150meters at 16 months 13:00 secs (with a turn) @ 37lbs 17.5 inches. if his bad comformation is holding him back oh well, hes still winning races. ;D "GREAT RACING SPECIMIN" oh nearly forgot ........................................hes black and white
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Post by frank on Dec 20, 2010 22:00:36 GMT
We'll always try to look for that 100% dog/bitch, but as you know, in the real world it doens't work like that, it's not always possible if your are looking for a "real" working dog. No offence but, you don't place real athletes with weak pasterns and yet you place a "non athlete" undershot dog 1st, isn't that judging with a "double standard" if skeleton conformation is on top of your list? Hello Moro, your interpretation of non athletic not mine obvously. I dont remember an undershot dog?. Moro i cant be arsed with this anymore. I wish id picked Franks judgeing apart last summer now as believe me there were comments there too. Frank says this approach is a more direct approach than the English. To me it is just pure Rude. Get off the band wagon mate, its not attractive. Neil I would have loved it if you had done that, as this is the only way to know or you missed something, or that you where wrong.
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Post by Shakka-Staffs on Dec 20, 2010 22:13:23 GMT
just to add i have no problem with either frank or neil, we all judge differently. Theres always going to be people who think youve chosen wrong dogs. Whoever the judge is or whatever right or wrong dogs are picked. As one of my mates would say "Whats done is done" we cant change it so lets move on.
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Post by dog on Dec 20, 2010 22:17:50 GMT
No Neil im not upset you know me, and i you, your right youve never said anything you havnt said to my face as far as i know. I know my dogs have never placed higher than 3rd apart from when they were puppies, when they both won all thier comformations lol. (even if it was by mistake) and i also know they have a few faults each. "WEAK COMFORMATION SPECIMINS" To all concerned as to my dogs shape size colour or anything else. Comformation for me !!!! I dont enjoy standing in a ring and niether really do my 2 muts i think were all bored of it. My wife has dragged us to every local/not so local, show for the past 3 years i have boxes of trophys and rosettes but it just dont do it for me. When we bred, apart from trying to improve on abbey, we bred to get ourselves a running stafford. Having already got ourselves a good allround pulldog. I said i wanted a stafford to win races, not too tall but all leg. I think i got exactly what i wanted. I could not be happier with the way hes turned out faults and all. How many people can say they bred thier first litter and got what they asked for ? Of course if id got both id be even happier but it really dont bother me as while it may not be to everyones cup of tea, running is what i do with my dogs and that is exactly what we wanted from our pup. While it may not be the purpose he was originally for, its what i wanted him for. 100meters at 16months 8:53 secs (lazer timed) 150meters at 16 months 13:00 secs (with a turn) @ 37lbs 17.5 inches. if his bad comformation is holding him back oh well, hes still winning races. ;D "GREAT RACING SPECIMIN" oh nearly forgot ........................................hes black and white Well said Shak. As I've said to yourself and to Tarren on various occasions I'm not keen on the conformation of Risky's line of Dogs but regardless of that I still consider them amongst the best, if not the best line of Staffords in this country, in fact my favourite Stafford is a Risky's bitch. If I wanted another Stafford Risky's Dogs would be on my shortlist. You achieved the aim of your breeding which was to improve the athleticism in the next generation, if you wanted a consistent show winner then you'd have probably gone for another line. That's the trouble with showing, it won't find the best Dog, only the Dog that has the best conformation in the eyes of that particular judge. From that point of view that it's best not to take showing too seriously.
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Post by neilsherlock on Dec 20, 2010 22:20:15 GMT
Shaka, cheers m8.
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Post by neilsherlock on Dec 20, 2010 22:29:01 GMT
well opinions are opinions, Whos is right, whos is wrong? I see conformation as extremely important. My job with horses involves trying to keep working animals with conformational defects on the road for as long as possible. Will dogs with poor conformation run slower?, probably not. will they jump as high ?, probably. Will they Pull as much? probably, Drive mentality gets them past this. Will they work as long as a well conformed dog ? Probably not.
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moro
New Member
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Post by moro on Dec 20, 2010 22:56:57 GMT
Shakka, it was not my intention to offend you or your dog(s), I tried to make a point while quoting Neil from the dutch forum what he said about Osiris. All the best.
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Post by neilsherlock on Dec 20, 2010 23:09:37 GMT
lol, keep it up martijn
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moro
New Member
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Post by moro on Dec 20, 2010 23:22:03 GMT
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Post by neilsherlock on Dec 20, 2010 23:30:12 GMT
your excused
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moro
New Member
Posts: 10
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Post by moro on Dec 21, 2010 0:19:27 GMT
well opinions are opinions, Whos is right, whos is wrong? I see conformation as extremely important. My job with horses involves trying to keep working animals with conformational defects on the road for as long as possible. Will dogs with poor conformation run slower?, probably not. will they jump as high ?, probably. Will they Pull as much? probably, Drive mentality gets them past this. Will they work as long as a well conformed dog ? Probably not. Although conformation is important, caracter should always be on top of your list with working dogs.
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Post by banksy on Dec 21, 2010 22:33:21 GMT
As one of my mates would say "Whats done is done" we cant change it so lets move on.
nice quote shakka
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Post by Shakka-Staffs on Dec 21, 2010 22:52:29 GMT
As one of my mates would say "Whats done is done" we cant change it so lets move on. nice quote shakka cant think what wanker says it though : hehehe.
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